Bending Spoons with your Mind?! Exploring Consciousness with Zenka Caro

In this special episode of Generation X Paranormal, we interview Zenka Caro, founder of Light Net—a groundbreaking quantum physics playground exploring consciousness, miracles, and holistic problem-solving. Zenka shares her visionary insights into the mysteries of human potential and the science behind the seemingly miraculous. Discover how Light Net is pushing the boundaries of what we know about consciousness, offering new perspectives on how we can connect with higher states of awareness and solve problems holistically. Whether you’re fascinated by quantum physics or curious about the mysteries of consciousness, this episode will inspire and captivate.

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Transcript

Not only can we glitch out of our bodies and be in that nothing, where we're there, then not there, whatever, we're not even sure how physical this reality really is.

Because if I can bend a spoon with my mind without touching, I mean, what does that say?

Generation X Paranormal.

Well, hey, everybody, welcome back.

Hey, everybody.

Generation X Paranormal, I'm Logan.

And I'm Nicole.

So we've seen The Matrix.

I like The Matrix, a great movie.

And do you remember the one scene where Neo is, no, it wasn't Neo holding it, it was some kid holding it.

He goes in to see The Oracle, and they're looking at a spoon, and the kid starts bending the spoon, and they get him through, anyway, they get into this long discussion, and I think they said something like, well, what's really gonna bake your noodle is the spoon's not even there.

You know, so, anyway, the reason I bring that up is we've got a pretty cool show.

We're gonna be talking to Zenka Caro, and there's a reason I brought up the bending spoons part.

So what can you tell us a little bit about Zenka?

So Zenka is the founder of Light Net, a collective intelligence think tank centered around consciousness.

She's a pioneer in mind over matter consciousness research.

She is an expert in spoon bending and electromagnetic radio ham radio contact with ETs and past loved ones.

She is passionate about blending science and spirituality and has been working in frontier technology for over 20 years, running software development companies and working in augmented reality.

She loves strategic planning for our best future and is an inspirational speaker on the TEDx stage and beyond.

Yeah, good old Ted speaks.

Let's go ahead and talk to Zenka.

Let's talk to her.

Well, hey, Zenka, welcome to Generation X Paranormal.

Hey, welcome, you guys too.

I'm excited.

Yeah, we're pretty excited.

You know, we get a lot of obviously with the paranormal, we kind of cover everything.

And I think one of the unique things that you bring to the table is something that, I guess, basically, I've been kind of curious about for a long time.

Yeah, me too.

With Yuri Geller and stuff like that.

But we'll jump into that at some point here.

But just before we do that, can you tell us a little bit about yourself, kind of what got you here?

Yeah, you know, I lived a very normal life.

I was working in technology, working in augmented reality and computer companies, software companies.

And I had, someone did a reiki on me, and I, my whole life passed before me.

Everything got synchronized.

I was like floating off the ground for two weeks.

I literally, it was night and day.

Right.

And then I went through a dark night of the school soul where I was creating a really bad situation in my life.

And I finally dragged myself up.

And I was like, wow, this is, I became highly curious about how reality worked.

And all these questions just like filled my mind.

And I was like, why didn't anyone tell me this in school?

Like, this is the most important thing I've ever experienced in my life.

And why isn't everyone talking about it?

And so all these synchronicities started happening and I quit my job and I started a nonprofit and I wanted to bring the science behind all this phenomenon to the front so that people that were skeptical could see that these are repeatable things.

And also so we could bring our collective intelligence around this and say like, what did you get?

What did you get?

What did you get?

And then compare notes and kind of say, okay, let's explore all this stuff together.

It's more fun.

And let's understand.

I just want to understand everything better.

So, yeah.

Well, that's awesome.

It's always funny because when we talk to people, we always kind of do the same thing.

Hey, what got you here?

You know, all the boilerplate stuff.

But it's funny that there's usually an event.

There's always the thing.

Yeah, you know, that's interesting.

Yeah, it was like, well, I led a norm, because I'm the same way.

I led a very normal life up to the point about a couple of years ago, had a brain bleed, and here we are.

I'm in discovery mode of all these certain things, and I am, I'm very much so as a skeptic between the two of us.

Yeah.

So, yeah.

Anyway.

What happened with your brain?

Like, how did you start to see things differently?

That is the $20,000 question.

I think for me, it was a lot to do with being a network engineer.

We talked about that a little before we started.

I'm a network engineer by trade, and I'm very algorithmic.

The one thing leads to another, leads to another, and if it doesn't, then it doesn't make sense.

Something's not right.

Find the thing that's in the algorithm that isn't working and make it work.

Well, the brain doesn't really work that way, at least not in the linear way that I perceived it.

So, yeah, it really just started there.

We're under some pressure, some stress, you know, life is normal, and I was sitting at my desk.

I was noticing that I would tell my hand to move, and it wouldn't move for about three seconds or so, and then you'd see it move, and I'm like, uh-oh, something's not right.

You know, the spidey sense took off on me a little bit there.

And yeah, it started with that, and then I started to see everything kind of like in frames, like nothing was fluid, and that was pretty frightening in its own.

And then for some reason, I decided, and this was really stupid, I should not have done what I did, but my boss was sitting right over here, and he goes, I said something to him, I was like, hey, can you follow me outside?

And I got up off my desk and went outside, which is, by the way, if you're ever thinking you're in a medical emergency, don't go off somewhere by yourself.

Yes, that was not smart.

That is the PSA of a lifetime for people.

So, but yeah, I just kind of went out, and yeah, next thing I know, the light shut off just like that.

And they found me laying on the floor outside next to a park bench, and I had a brain bleed.

And that was that.

And ever since then, it's not just been the quest.

I think everybody has a quest for things, and I think humanity has a general understanding for how they want to do certain things.

But for me, it was more of a, okay, something weird's happening.

Because I shut down and then there was darkness.

And then I was again.

So for that brief moment in time, there was no me.

And that's what really kind of, I guess kind of got me where I'm at now.

That search of, okay, well, where did I go?

What happened?

I don't know.

It's hard to explain to somebody the difference between complete darkness and nothingness.

It's a void.

It was a huge void.

There was me, then there was nothing, and then there was me again.

So it's weird.

It's like, I don't know.

I mean, for lack of better words, like that glitch in the Matrix, you know, where the people, you see the cat twice?

I don't know, you know?

Wow.

Yeah, that's what got me to that.

Oh, fascinating.

Yeah, so fascinating.

It was scary, but yeah.

Yeah.

My aunt had a, you know, a bleed in her brain, and I visited her and she was like seeing things and was like, yeah, real and I've known people who've gotten hit in the head and then have become incredibly psychic and different things.

So it's interesting how we have these slices of reality that we can perceive.

And you're right.

Like we know as a fact, we're not our bodies.

Like that's not the full picture.

Right.

I was realizing the other day, I was getting these intuitive hits, like make sure you pick this up at the supermarket.

While I was there, I was like, oh, you know, I was like, oh, but I don't need that.

And then I would get home and like, oh, I needed that or make sure you do this thing.

And then I was like, oh, you know, so that basically implies that a part of you is seeing into the future.

Yeah.

Right?

For sure, yeah.

So what is that?

What part of you is like that?

Or what guidance do we have?

I mean, so interesting, right?

This is, we're not our bodies.

And, you know, remote viewing is a great example.

You know, there's people that leave their bodies, go over there, look at what it is.

And, you know, so we've really, this is really fascinating stuff to me to understand, you know, you can get in and out of the car.

Right.

Yeah.

And it was hard to explain, you know, and I'm sure you'll probably resonate with this pretty well.

And Nicole's no different.

We didn't, we didn't start this way.

We let very normal, I say normal, I mean, what the heck does that mean?

But, you know, we led very traditional, let's just say, day to day.

And, you know, it's just one of those things that just kind of sent our whole world enough people.

And that wasn't the first time we were up against, you know, some oddities.

But it was definitely for me, it was the first time.

And I just hit the nice, ripe old age of 50 this year.

So it took it was a long time to get here.

So, yeah.

Yeah.

And now the whole world is coming around to ask these questions.

Like this is not that it used to be shrouded in like, whatever clubs and this and that.

And now it's like, okay, it's on TikTok.

Yeah.

I mean, it used to be right.

TikTok did it.

Yeah, TikTok did it.

It used to be, you're right, it used to be kind of like that thing of, you know, was said in like quiet corners and nobody spoke about it.

And if you-

Shrouded in mystery.

Yeah.

Mystery schools, Masonic temples, like all that stuff, right?

Right.

Exactly.

It's such an interesting odyssey, you know, of what's happened from just in my, you know, amount of time being on this planet to where we're at today, I, you know, it just, it blows my mind.

But what's good is that we have folks like you and, you know, we have people that we can sit and talk to and rationalize and say, okay, here's all the crap that makes sense.

And then here is this ginormous chasm of stuff that does not make sense.

And just trying to fish through some of that.

But yeah, so I got to ask, only because I am pretty ignorant of it, aside from Yuri Geller and aside from like the Matrix, when you watch, you know, Neo bend the spoon.

Can you unpack a little bit about the science of bending spoons?

Yeah, yeah, sure.

You know, you're just saying that, and we're just based on our recent discussion we were having, is like, not only can we glitch out of our bodies and be in that nothing, where we're there, they're not there, whatever, we're not even sure how physical this reality really is.

Because if, if, if I can bend a spoon with my mind without touching, I mean, what does that say?

Yeah.

So, so it's what we do, we have a method that we use.

Yuri Geller is an interesting guy.

He started, you know, when he was young, he saw a big huge flash in a park.

And it kind of knocked him down.

He was a young boy and he ran home.

And his spoon, like at some point after that event, his spoon just melted into his cereal, like, you know, just melted.

And he was like, whoa.

And instead of running away from that, like a lot of people do, he went straight into it.

He was like, cool, I'm not good at sports.

I'm not good at academics.

I'm just, this is going to be my thing.

And he built a very successful life around it.

You know, he was hired by the military in the US, in England, and he never took money from the military in Israel.

None of those he took money from, but he, you know, he would work for oil companies like, okay, here's where the gold is or the oil or whatever.

And it was worth it to pay him a million dollars to walk out of his house because he would, he literally passed through a situation where he could, he could know things and we all can know things, you know?

But the way that we do it is we, we cause a lot of chaos in the environment.

So we do this once a month.

We just did one like two days ago and total beginners, like we got on the call.

No one had ever done it before.

And they get there and they're like, what?

And it's like, yeah, well, you have to want, it's not like you have to want to, but the first step is opening yourself in some sense to, oh, I want to be her, I want to do this, this is a possibility.

And when you come into our lab, there's even a better possibility because we have huge success ratios, like 86 percent, 96 percent of everyone.

So it's not like there's anything special about those people.

It's not like, oh, you're a medium, it might have taken you a while to get that craft going.

There's been many you can do from in one day, just like no experience of doing it.

One of the things we do is we start with a pendulum, and we ask ourselves, can I bend this spoon?

Will you bend for me today kind of thing?

And that gets permission from your subconscious mind to your conscious mind that you guys are going to be doing this.

Because oftentimes, your subconscious mind, 95% of your thoughts, beliefs is creating your entire reality, and you don't even know it.

So your conscious mind is like, oh, I want to get that job.

And your subconscious mind is like, you're not good enough, you're never going to get it, you don't deserve it.

You don't know what you're doing.

So you're not getting that job.

That reality is not going to manifest into your life because your thoughts, feelings and emotions are some other direction.

So the other thing we do is once we get permission from our subconscious mind to be on board with it, is that we do a quick meditation, but the meditation doesn't even matter.

Jack Howe taught 16,000 people how to do it, and the meditation didn't matter.

It wasn't effective results, so he threw that out.

We invite kids to come free, because they're in theta and alpha brainwaves a lot, and they're not worried about how they look, if they get it right or not.

So a lot of times when people start to benefit, and they're like, oh my God, why isn't my mind bending?

It could be happening for me.

What's going on?

That is all reverse manifesting.

That is taking you further away from being able to do it, right?

So what you want to do is stop thinking.

And we do that by focusing on other people.

So we cause a lot of chaos.

We play super cool music, and it's just like, ah, and you're just like, and the first time we say bend, bend, bend, and we say, let it go.

And then you just like, and then whoever bends is like screaming, it's like, oh my God, it didn't look at this.

You guys, this is so crazy.

And at some point, your brain just like, you can't even think anymore, but your brain is seeing someone holding their thing up.

And your brain is like, is not able to deal with like so much chaos.

And then there's a belief change.

This goes, and everyone tends to just bend all at once.

It's like they get caught up in the moment, like the women pulling the car off for kid, you know, it's like thinking like, am I going to hurt my back?

You know, she's like, get this thing.

Like she's not thinking, she's not thinking.

And that's the thing.

We, we, we, you know, our thinking mind is probably the car insurance, right?

If our body is where our soul is, it's the car insurance that's like, hey man, we don't want to just like everyone, you know, get like direct car all the time, you know?

So there's a part of you that's like really in that.

But then there's another part of you that like a kid, just reckless abandoned toward whatever they want to do, right?

And so you don't have all the societal conditionings.

You don't have, I mean, we have a levitation lab, as crazy as that sounds, we have a levitation lab at Light Net.

So there's people that have levitated.

There's people that are breatharians, too.

I mean, have you ever heard of that?

Like people, they don't eat and they're living.

They've convinced their brain, right?

That there's no food required and they live for months and months and months.

They become, so if someone can do that, then we can do X, Y, Z.

So the whole point of spoon-bending is to be like, hey, you're creating your reality with the experiences that you want to live, and it's being created through your society's mind, and through your mind, and through your mom's mom's mom's mind, right?

It's all in there, right?

And we can attach to stories.

I mean, that's what we're doing at Light Net, is we're attaching people to stories where they're seeing role models that have done the things they want to do.

Like, we have a paralysis lab, an addiction lab.

So attaching the story to someone that is free of their addiction, and they're like, hey, that person did it, like I can too.

So it's creating the seed of that belief and then allowing yourself to momentarily suspend your imagination.

So, for example, you go into the job interview and your mind is going, oh my gosh, I'm so nervous, I'm not going to get this.

I don't even know what I'm talking about.

Like, they're going to ask me this and that, and I don't even know.

Like, people, like a dog, people will sense that, it will be there, it's there, it's energy.

Energy doesn't lie, it's right there, right?

And so, what we need to do is attach more to where we're going and what we want to do and what we want to create in our life and be an undying faith to that reality of that we want to experience, whether it's bending the spoon or getting out of the wheelchair or getting off drugs or whatever it is, right?

And eventually, your reality will accommodate that need to experience that thing.

Reality is much more pliable than we realize.

And that's the case in point with the spoon bending.

I mean, we're breaking the laws of physics.

I mean, it's just it's not possible in the world that we know, and yet hundreds and hundreds and hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of people.

We've taught hundreds of people to do it.

So it's it is possible.

Yeah, but we live in cage in our mind.

We live in cages in our mind.

You know, it's funny, you say our mind is like insurance.

And I started for some reason, I thought if my mind was insurance, it's like that Liberty Mutual guy where he says liberty, liberty, because my anyway.

OK, so yeah, I'm not really sure how to unpack people not eating for months, but that's I have heard of one woman a long time ago that would go out in the morning and she said she basically ate sunlight.

She would do yoga like when the sun would rise and she hadn't eaten like a month.

Wow.

And at the time, I was just like, there's no way she's had to eat something.

But yeah, she said she would just eat the vitamin D from the sun.

That's amazing.

And I had a friend that did it too.

And she was like, I was just called to that.

And so she studied with a group that was doing that all did it and then guru that had done it.

And it's like, I mean, I also have this word called Hocus Pocus.

So Hocus Pocus is everything you need to have to convince yourself that you can do something.

That's why, so she's saying, oh, it's sunlight.

Maybe it is.

But that's her belief structure, that if it was, you know, all of a sudden, the sun didn't come out, she might feel like she needed to eat.

And that's why, like a doctor being like, you're going to die in two weeks from cancer.

That's like creating a belief in you, right?

Or a channeler that's like, oh, you're going to become a successful, like author.

And then these people believe it from the time they saw the, the like whatever the psychic or whatever.

You got to be careful who you're with, right?

With the psychic, because that you're just like, oh my God, it's like they see the future.

Like, so you've, you've just created that belief, but you can create your own belief, right?

About your future.

And, and, and so, I mean, we're doing Purpose Lab is our big project right now, because we're just finishing our Starseed Academy teams, remote viewing and all this stuff.

But now we're working on Purpose because, because when people have a goal outside of themselves, this bigger than themselves, whether it's making your podcast successful or whatever, you create a ton of synchronicities around that.

You create a belief, you get on like some sort of thing that moves forward.

And people are like miracles, you know, doors, there's only walls and now there's doors, you know, it's like something about their passion comes out.

And so part of our mission at Light Net right now is to help people connect to the thing they love, to connect why they're here.

Because it's my belief that you probably chose and designed a little bit of your experience right now that you're having.

And you might have had a kind of a thing that you wanted to do, like your soul's mission or your soul path.

And it feels really good to be on that path because it feels like you're yourself.

And it feels like it's fun and scary at the same time.

It feels like it's like there's a lot of cool stuff.

And that is where miracles happen.

It's when you're in it.

Right, for sure.

I've heard that before.

Yeah, and it's funny because intention is everything, right?

I mean, if you find yourself, and you don't really even need to go deep into the explanation of paranormal, to know that if you tell yourself the same thing over and over, you're going to manifest whatever that is.

It's just, it's out there.

Well, and you know when things feel right.

Yeah, and when they feel wrong, you just ignore it most of the time.

Yeah, that's fascinating.

Well, I think you're right.

I think, yeah, just to go back on that, like I think telling yourself over and over again, something that you might not yet believe, but you want to believe, that is valid.

Yeah, right.

Because eventually, there's no, it just, it shows up, it has to show up.

It's weird.

If you do it and you try it, it works.

It works.

It works.

Yeah.

I guess, looking over a few things too, with notes and everything, I know that time dilation is a big part of it too.

I find that obviously very, very fascinating because we've spoken to a few different people like Micra, Exequer and stuff and people like that where they talk about time, not just, you know, stack time theory and time dilation.

How does that, how does that, I guess basically, how does that impact what you do?

And especially like spoon bending.

This is my greatest obsession is time.

But what is time stack theory?

So what he kind of, now I will give you the probably worst explanation and I wish it was here.

But basically all parts of time are moving at the same, kind of going at the same rate.

Rate.

And it's fluid.

It can go backwards and forwards.

It's not just linear.

So one of the beliefs is that ghost, for lack of better words, are you seeing that as a specter or is that actually an intrusion of their time into your time?

And it's a time slip.

So they all exist at the same time, kind of like the same thing as far as like, I guess different dimensions, for lack of better words.

So you can kind of go in between these stacked times or these different dimensions to, well, to wherever you want.

And I don't know if you've ever seen the movie Somewhere in Time with Christopher Reeve.

It's a pretty old one, but, but he, I think he would look at a penny and he would fixate on the penny.

And as he fixated on it, he was able to, to move into that other, that other time.

And that's what Mike Ricksecker thinks.

If there's such a thing as time travel, that's how we do it.

We would have to do it from our conscious mind.

No DeLorean.

Yeah, there's no, no, there's not going to be in a machine.

Let's just say that it'll be because we figured out how to do it from our mind.

Yeah.

And Mike, if I botched that, I'm sorry.

But that's kind of my understanding of it.

He does much better at explaining it.

He does.

Well, so, yeah, time is really interesting.

And I believe, okay, so here's how I've seen it work in spoon-bending.

So when you're impatient with time, when you're spoon-bending, you're like, why isn't mine bending?

It's not bending.

You start to get on the wrong road, right?

Right.

Because you're doubting, first of all, which is not good because that's part of the energy, right?

And then you're going like, when is it gonna happen?

We do, we do these experiments too, as part of our laboratories that are called Blooming, where we bloom things into existence with no direct like it has to happen in this hour, right?

So we bloom like purple cars and we'll be like, okay, we're gonna see purple cars.

And all of a sudden we start seeing the purple cars coming into our reality.

But we hold it looser because the time is like it could happen tomorrow or the next day or the next day.

Try it, by the way.

Look for some purple cars in the next two weeks and you'll start to see them more and more.

It's very fascinating.

So I think that time, they say that all time is happening simultaneously.

I mean, that would make one believe that you can basically experience any version of yourself.

There's a version of you that Ben Spoon's already.

And one of my parties, you know?

And so what is it that you're trying to experience?

And if we're not our bodies, then we can essentially, there's more than one of us.

There's Zenka that never got awoken.

And I'm just doing my corporate job or whatever.

I'm running my tech company, doing websites and augmented reality.

But I think one of the things that we've been fascinated to by time is that when that girl picks up the car for kid, and when you're in an accident, time totally slows down.

It's like that bullet can, that slow thing.

And I think that's also in brainwave states.

So we also have the belief, well, science is teaching us that if you get in a certain brainwave state, your reality is different.

Probably your perception of it or your consciousness is different.

So another thing we do in spoon bending and a lot of the healing work, I mean, I know, like reiki and all the stuff is to get in your heart, to get in your love, get in...

So we think about people we love, we invite them to come help us, we're just like, we think about happy places.

I saw a guy who had two forks like this.

And he was just like in his happy place with his eyes closed and his forks were just bending.

And this is a guy that wouldn't, wasn't able to do it other way.

He couldn't do the kindergarten.

So all of a sudden.

So yeah, I'm interested in time travel too.

I think that I am a time traveler actually.

And sometimes I'm like annoyed at by the time that I've ended up being in, like because it doesn't feel exactly right.

Yeah.

But, you know, yeah, so it's very interesting, like if we've already lived this experience and we're coming back, like it makes you a little bit more playful about where we are.

That's one thing, like a lot of the sages, like they're just like, don't take this too seriously, you know, because we lose our like, oh, throw it all, like throw the rules out.

What am I doing?

You know, and like that's really come up for me in the last year.

And I'm just like, all right, if I could have anything come true, if this was a dream, like what would I actually want?

You know, how would I, how would I see this?

And right now it's like finding levitators and finding people that got out of wheelchairs and figuring out what they did to break the matrix of their mind.

Because they obviously broke it hard, just like the, you know, the, the breath area, it's like they broke down all logic.

And so this isn't as logical as we think it is.

Consciousness is fundamental.

It's more fundamental than matter.

So how you think about things is important.

And that's why we, you know, it's really good to, we used to wear bracelets.

So you have a bracelet.

And when you're thinking a thought or you're experiencing a reality that you do not prefer, you move the bracelet to the other side.

So it's an acknowledgement like, hey, wait a minute.

Where am I right now?

Yeah.

Why am I creating this reality?

What?

Why am I here?

Why am I creating this?

And then you start to put it on the other thing.

And the more and more we empower ourselves to be in the right place and in the right version of ourselves, the more empowering it gets.

And the more we can live the way we truly are meant to live, because each one of us is different.

So your perfect life is different than my perfect life.

But it's all like, I'm in this program right now called Mind Flavors, and they're saying create your reality from the inside out.

So we spend all our time reacting, reacting, reacting, or trying to gain the way society has it, or this or that.

But there's a school of thought that's saying no.

How we think and feel and are is what's going to produce itself on our external reality.

Sure.

Yeah.

And that resonates incredibly.

Yeah, it does.

You know, it's one of those where, again, we all have an event that kind of brings us to where we're at now.

And when you're here, and I hate to say it that way because sometimes I feel like I'm holding the cards and going, how you guys can't see.

But it kind of feels like unless you're on this side, it's hard to see that from that other side.

When you're living that day to day, the that grind, so to speak, you just feel that oppression that you can't find any other way out until something happens.

And boom, now all of a sudden, you're awakened just like yourself.

And you're like, man, I wish I'd have known this X amount of years ago.

Because things just make a heck of a lot more sense.

And life is a heck of a lot easier to live.

Yeah, so that's something to remember.

Like when you're experiencing a lot of pain and a lot of discomfort, it's like whenever I've experienced a lot of pain and discomfort, it just goes like more.

It's like a tornado that just gets worse and worse.

And it just gets more and more and deeper and deeper.

And the drama just goes like, whoa.

And the other day, these people, Carl and Amy from I Am Flavers, they're like, okay, you just have to breathe, do candle breaths.

Like literally 20 times.

And they were like, you just have to get that out, like get it out of.

And I was like, that's the last thing I wanted to do.

I didn't want to do.

I don't want to breathe.

Like, no, you know, like, no.

I just was like mad.

I want, you know, whatever.

And pretty soon I realigned myself to what I present, like what I actually preferred and things like that.

And then all of a sudden things started shifting almost immediately.

So, I mean, one of the things that happened the other day, I mean, and this is this is a real story.

This actually happened.

I was like complaining about my relationship with my son.

Like, oh, I wish it was better and like, you know, she likes to play video games with his dad, but he's not that like, you know, into what I have to do with him or whatever.

And I was like, oh my God.

And they were like, well, wait a minute, write down everything that you want that relationship to look like.

You know, it's like, okay, I want him to feel love and appreciate it.

I want, you know, I want us to go on adventures together.

I, you know, all I want a deep connection with him.

And I meditated on it.

I said, you know, I love you, Nico did all this stuff.

I picked him up that day.

And he was a totally different kid.

He was like, you know, I love you so much.

He's like, mom, every time I say I hate you, it just, just, it actually means I love you.

And he's like, thanks for taking me to play tennis with tennis balls.

And was just like, appreciate, I mean, it was like a whole nother kid.

So that's an example of how I shifted myself inside and all of a sudden I saw an immediate result.

And it was so immediate and so different.

It made me and extremely question how reality works.

And my mind is already pretty big, you know?

In terms of like what I'm like accepting of reality.

So I encourage everyone to do experiments in your life, where if you're not experiencing what you want in a certain relationship or with certain thing, try imagining what you want.

It's very hard to imagine something that doesn't exist in your life, you know, because you have nothing to go on.

You know, I actually had to sit there and go, wait a minute, what do I want the relationship to look like between me and my 10 year old?

You know, like what, what am I actually, what, what, what do you even want?

You know, so that's like a first thing, because otherwise it's this nebulous thing.

And then I wrote power declarations, like I love Nico, Nico loves me, like I wrote this out, you know what I mean?

And I basically, you know, sent him love and you know, so it's, it's getting into that, being into, into that final state of what that is.

And we do this in spoonbending where we're like, congratulations, you bent a spoon before they've even bent a spoon.

They're, they're in, you know, it's what they say, you know, about it.

So it's, it's, it's available.

It's available.

And our lives can be an experiment because what could be more fun than living your preferences, because you are unique.

You're not supposed to live my preferences.

You're not supposed to live the preferences of your mom or your society.

It's something unique in you.

And when that comes out, it's so freeing and so fun that you end up being able to give your gifts away to other people because you're happy when you're making a meal or you're happy when you're teaching a class or whatever you're doing, right?

Because there's a deeper satisfaction.

Yeah, it's true because I often found that, and this is just something that I'll even interject in our own marriage, where the second I learn to stop, I guess, projecting my shortcomings, all the things that made me feel bad on to her or on to anybody else, things changed quite a bit.

I think projection is a big part of it, not only intention, but if you're projecting a lot of negativity or if you're projecting, and I hope this is okay, but using your example, you were projecting, there's a grind, there's something not going right, and that was just out there and you just kept ruminating on it and it just kept playing over and over.

And I think the moment you changed that and you visualized it kind of the way you did, now you're projecting a different frequency or a different, I mean, for lack of better words, a different vibe out there.

So it's out there in the ether now.

Negativity versus positivity is what I hear from everything.

You think positive, positive things come back.

It's your energy.

Yeah, and this is just from some dude.

I mean, I don't know, you know, I don't really have anything crazy to offer other than the fact that the moment that I did that, you know, I found that life just got a lot easier and things started to fall a little bit more in a place for me.

Yeah, and back to the time thing.

It's like, you don't know when all that's going to clear out.

That's why the breathing is actually good, because you clear it out of your body, your whole thing, because like your cellular memory, your physical memory, you know, and even if you have like closures that you do in your mind with another person or through meditation, like say that thing you needed to say, close it, be done, right?

Because then it's not going to keep showing up, because you got to clear your subconscious minds.

And in order for good things to happen to you, you often have to have the self-love component, which for me was hard because I'm always trying to like make everyone feel good and love everyone else and make, you know, smooth everything over.

And then you don't really have that connection, loving connection with yourself.

And yet that is the, that's the deserving part that you need to manifest your purpose or your whatever you want to experience.

If you don't feel like you deserve money or deserve success or deserve a good relationship or whatever, or whatever, it's, it just like, you know, and the other day, I mean, I was like, I didn't even believe that my relationship with my son could get better.

I didn't, it wasn't even in my belief.

Yeah.

So that is like, that's like, okay, that is, that is red flag number one.

Like that has to be adjusted.

Like I had to believe that in some version, we were going to be super tight and close and it was going to be awesome, you know, and that I deserved that too, you know, like all that stuff, you know, adds up, adds up, adds up and it's really good.

That's where like you guys as partners, you know, it's really good to have a friend or a partner saying like, I need you to believe in me, to get me over to this change, that I'm, this is where I'm going for.

I'm feeling a lot of negativity about this.

I'm feeling a lot of disappointment, lack of faith, lack of hope, lack of anything, anger, whatever.

And I want to get on the other side.

And I'm asking you to support and believe in me while I do that.

And then you wait and it does sometimes take time.

Absolutely.

Because your brain doesn't want change, by the way.

No, it doesn't.

Change in your brain registered as pain.

So change to your brain, to your insurance policy on the automobile.

It's like you're moving to California.

I don't know what it's like over there.

No, no, no, no, no.

It's like, no, any change is like, I don't know, I'm going to have to rewrite the insurance policy.

This is going to be super complicated.

I would rather just keep driving in, you know, Sinonai, we know where you're growing and all this stuff.

Like it's just like hissy fit.

And so you've also got to realize that any change is something that you have to override with your desire.

That's why purpose intentions are really good is because you're almost in love with something.

You know, it's like when you're in love, it's like all the pain of whatever, like, oh yeah, I walked two miles to go to his house, like whatever.

You know, it's like that pain doesn't even matter.

Yeah, because you've overridden it with your desire.

Yeah, absolutely true.

So I'm kind of transitioning a little bit because it's like, wow, what a, I could probably talk for the next four hours on this stuff because I just find it so fascinating.

But you had some some radios there.

And I definitely want to kind of shift a little bit into that because this is also something that I know that you do.

And I'm very curious.

I'm not going to lie.

So am I.

I'm really curious.

So we are obviously big, we're paranormal folks.

So we're in UFOs and ufology and stuff like that.

So tell us a little bit about the, well, making music with the extraterrestrials.

Yeah.

So we, you know, because we like to do grounded, repeatable science at Light Net, we started using Jimmy Blanchett's method for using ham radios.

We have like over 25 radios.

They're all on 144.101.

And what happens is, you just heard this.

I don't know if you heard any chirps, probably you did.

Yeah, I did.

But this was, yeah.

So this was the only radio that was making noise.

And these are all on the same channel.

Yep.

Hello, hello, hello.

Which shouldn't exist.

You see that?

You see the lights all came on because of hello, right?

So there's no possible way that there is normal physics or normal, anything going on right here.

So these are permission portals that we have with ETs and past loved ones, where they know how to trip the circuits in there.

It's not even radio waves, actually, that they're even using because we can put these in Faraday cages where we're blocking out all of the electromagnetic waves.

So they can't, you couldn't even get radio signal in a cage, right?

Like that, so this has been really interesting.

So we have said, okay, yeah, you can use this to communicate.

And by the way, we developed a yes, no communication system.

So one beep is yes, two beeps is no, three beeps is ask another question, and four beeps is clapping.

So we have encountered this incredible conversation, like it's a permission portal that we have with them that allows us to ask, you know, you can ask, you can find out anything about anyone.

If you have yes or no communication, right?

Because I can go through like, are you an Octarian?

Are you a, like, Philaean?

Are you a Syrian?

Like, whatever, right?

So it's been really interesting.

And as our labs have progressed over time, so we have these labs of eight people to 10 people, eight to 12 people.

And we set out to do impossible things together because it's more fun and it's more interesting and we get our curiosity working.

And so at one point, we had gotten voices coming over the radio, we've gotten images that sent us back, and we got yes and no answers.

And I was like, let's make music.

It's not logical.

It's not like the rational mind.

Okay.

So yeah, they just said, yeah.

I heard it.

Yeah.

And they were like, and so we, we did this whole thing.

We got all this equipment out, like different theremin, phone apps, ghost radio apps, like everything.

And we got eight people together that were, that their intention was like, yeah, in eight weeks, or things are always eight weeks.

In eight weeks, we're going to make this happen.

And sure enough, they played back.

And they would play everything.

I mean, they would play these phone apps that were, they would play piano.

They sounded terrible.

Probably like me, right?

Cause I don't know how to play piano either.

But I mean, this one guy was like going on and on and on on the guitar.

So there's like a phone app, right?

For ghost radio or whatever.

It's sitting there and nothing's happening, right?

And then all of a sudden it starts to play the guitar and it went on.

It did not want to stop.

It was like, you know, it was like, it was like, it was incredible.

And this happened, you know, we were just, we were touched by the whole experience.

Experience.

We would make music videos with them.

Like, I mean, this was like a true cultural exchange.

And, you know, it's my belief that they're right here, right?

We can't see them, but I know they see me.

It's not like they're in some ship, like, far away.

They're actually beside you because I can tell, because they answer questions from my thoughts.

So they're telepathic and they, and they react to things that I haven't said out loud.

So it's not like they can just hear me, right?

Right.

Um, you know, yeah.

So it's, it's, it's been very interesting and it's, it's great to do this with a small group of people, like your community is like with you, right?

So it's easier to see a UFO with a bunch of people that believe in UFOs than a bunch of people who are like, uh, I don't believe this.

You know what I mean?

Because there's no, it's like, it squashes your childlike sense and you just don't, you don't allow yourself to go there, you know?

And when you're with open minded people, just like, you know, is it, is a boy whose mom believes that he can do anything like write a book or not write a book?

Is that boy going to be able to write the book better than if the mom was like, don't even try that.

Everyone writes books, you'll never be able to write, you know, something that will ever get published because there's too much competition.

I mean, it's, you know, those are your beliefs about it.

Yeah, that's very true.

It is very, very true.

And you know, even with like, like ghost hunting, I hate that word, but people use it, we call it more paranormal investigations.

But if you go in there with a big group of people and everybody is just downtrodden, first of all, that really impacts the type of the energy that you're going to get and the energy that's out there.

But I think it does help manifest because you're putting that intention out.

You're part of that.

That I don't know, I don't know what the word I'm looking for, but it's important.

Well, all of your energy is coming together.

Right.

Yeah, exactly.

So I wouldn't see how it would be any different than with like ET Contact, where, you know, if everybody, and I think we're speaking with, with I think Mike and Sam about them doing with Andrew Paran.

Oh, yeah.

Go out and everybody would do the manifesting.

And then she was able to bring extraterrestrial in.

So no, that's, that's amazing.

And it's so cool.

It's just funny.

I was thinking about it.

You guys are making music for, you know, YouTube videos with the ETs.

And I wonder if they got a copyright strike on them, you know, but that's awesome.

So when you guys do that, what is, I would imagine everybody in that, in that group is absolutely floored.

But how does that, first of all, wow.

I mean, what do they, how do you communicate that?

I mean, everybody gets this like mass experience.

How does that, and where do you go from there?

And it was, it was so fascinating because like they, you know, we're together for, you know, eight weeks and the first two weeks they didn't do anything.

It was like silence.

And we were like, okay.

And I was adamant that I thought that we should spend 20 minutes listening to them.

Because if we were talking and making music for them the whole time, they weren't going to like, I don't know, we weren't going to ever hear them.

So we would, no matter what, we would be 20 minutes of just doing nothing, like just sitting there.

And after the second week, I was like, okay, wait a minute.

We need to sing to them.

Like we need to come from our hearts.

Like we're getting a lot of messages in the silence that was like, okay, we're supposed to do this and this.

When we started singing to them, sounded terrible because we're just like random people, right?

Then they started playing back and they did it.

And it was, it was just such a like an interesting experience.

Because for me, this is like, I'm the type of person, and you guys are too, that's comfortable in the frontier of the known, right?

Like, I would be, I almost like, I mean, this is like crazy to say, but like it would be so boring to me.

I was wouldn't want to live just like doing the same old thing that we've done for generation after generation after generation.

I'm just like, let's keep learning, discovering, being curious, you know?

And so I think, I think that that's the spirit of it.

And for me, getting to talk to the other side, whether it is a past love on or an ET, maybe we're all ETs having a human experience, you know, you know, it's like, okay.

So whatever that is, that's interesting to me.

I want to know about the unseen and you know, who knows like this could all just be a story that you're having in your head as you dream on an on a bed and an avatar movie, you know, like, right.

You want to experience ET contact, that experience will come to you if you're intentional enough about it.

And if you want it badly enough in your heart and you let yourself allow yourself to experience and clear out your subconscious mind, you can reprogram your subconscious mind like that.

You literally just do like my friend Rachel Firebug does, like it's called a prayer command where you're like, look, I am removing this thought from my mind.

Show me what it feels like to be in this.

I am in speaking it out loud can be powerful too.

Like I'm here to see E.T.'s, I'm here to see spacecraft tonight.

And then just be in the joy and excitement of it.

And you don't have to ask when, because if you're like, why aren't they coming?

I don't see anything like, oh my gosh, you bought this whole person here and they're cold and they want to go.

That is all taking you away from the experience, right?

Cause the universe is confused.

It's like, well, did you want them to come or not?

Like control your thoughts.

Right.

For sure.

That makes sense.

That's negative coming out then.

Yeah.

And even if they would show up, if you're negative like that, is that really?

They don't want to be a part of that.

I can't blame them.

I wouldn't.

No.

Yeah.

You know, it's all very fascinating, Zenka.

It is.

Wow.

I appreciate you kind of bringing everything to light.

You know, I knew we would have a lot of fun, but it just, that's amazing.

All the stuff that you guys do, you know, kind of in closing, I know our audience is going to want to know how to get a hold of you and, and how to basically kind of be a part of what you've got.

Can you kind of give us a little bit of where they can get a hold of you and how they can reach out to you?

Yes.

So so we're going to be in Japan in a week and a half doing a Starseed Academy event, a contact event.

We're going to teach people spoon bunnies, something like that.

But I doubt people are going to hop on a plane.

But but so the best thing is to go to one of our sites, lightnet.org or starseedacademy.org and just check out the upcoming events and say, okay, I want to do spoon bunning or whatever.

Right.

We do those once a month and we have community stuff that you can come and enjoy.

And then if you that our next teams are purpose lab teams.

So if you want to find your purpose, if you want to feel that source of magic in you and know why you're here, we invite you to go to holomovement.net/teams.

And that's where we're forming our next seven teams where you get in a group of eight people and miracles happen.

We've been doing this for long enough that we pretty much guarantee you get in a team and we'll pull you through.

That's awesome.

That's great.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, thank you so much.

Yeah.

We've had a blast and I hope you had enjoyed yourself.

Yeah.

But one thing before we closed, did you say Sedona?

Yes.

Is that where you're at?

Yeah.

I moved from LA to Sedona.

We love Sedona.

I'm from Arizona.

So that's when I'm like, what?

Yeah, I'm from Tucson originally.

So cool.

Yeah.

So look me up when you went, if you come here, it's like so open minded here, right?

So everyone is seeing ships.

I mean, you can go out every single night and see ships.

It's not a thing.

So cool.

And I have friends that feed Sasquatch at Bradshaw Ranch.

It's cool because you're not limiting yourself by the thoughts of others, for sure, because the people are pretty like, huh, like open minded here.

So it's been really nice.

I've been here for like four years.

So jealous.

Yes, very jealous.

Thank you so much again.

And really hope to speak with you again sometime.

Yeah.

Thanks so much for having me.

Thanks for all you're doing to keep everyone curious and exploring the frontier.

Awesome.

Thank you.

Yeah.

Okay.

Well, there's a lot to unpack there.

There was a lot there.

She's definitely...

the thing with the radios is cool.

Yeah, it's really cool.

I mean, it's basically like...

I mean, it is Paranormal Investigation.

Yeah.

You're just not doing it with spirits.

You're doing it with ETs.

Hmm.

I don't know if...

I would love to see that though.

Yeah, maybe we should, you know, we'll go out there and...

I mean, honestly.

Yeah.

And it's a ham radio, which is...

Yeah.

And I mean, while we're speaking to her, you could hear the little things going on.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I hope you guys heard that, because it was pretty wild.

And then, you know, of course, the spoon stuff.

I mean...

I've always been fascinated with that, even since I was a kid.

Like, how can they possibly do that?

Yeah.

I mean, I know the mind is very capable of things.

It is.

I mean, and she was speaking about the people not being able to eat, which I was like, how can they possibly do that?

But, you know, I was a psychology major in college, and a lot of my professors would talk about that, about people would convince themselves of things, and it would happen.

Like, the biggest story I remember from school is there was a woman that, you know, wanted to be pregnant so badly that she convinced herself she was.

Her stomach actually grew, like her menstrual things stopped.

I mean, all the things that happen when you're actually pregnant happen to this lady.

Yeah.

But there was no baby.

It's just wild.

It is wild.

So, I mean, our minds are capable of these things.

Yeah.

It's just like she said, it's convincing the subconscious, the little, you know, it's like the little guys on your shoulder.

Oh, yeah.

You can do this, you can't do this.

Yeah.

It's making this one be quiet, which is a lot harder.

Speaking of little ones in the corner, I don't know if you guys saw it, but our dog made an appearance.

So if you saw him, yeah, give us a comment and tell us what you saw.

But yeah, well, hey, guys, thank you so much.

We had a great time and we'll see you next week.

Talk to you next week.